This is from previous questioning of mine from another Wildfire Today article: Team to Begin Chimney Tops 2 Fire: I appreciate your more thorough break down of backfire. So whether the defendants started the 14th fire or not, a close examination of this Facebook press release indicates the fire apparently started on the 13th; and yet a social media photo post claims the 12th clearly showing a lack of response once again in fire suppression by the NPS. We were there on Thanksgiving week-end. Millions of dollars will be spent recovering and mitigating the after effects of this human caused and exasperated wildfire. The individual was identified as Joe Martin Bates, 54, according to the Sevier County Medical Examiners office. I bet someone of you one here would sing a different tune if you loss a big chunk of your retirement because of someone incompetence. Im sure there will be lots of finger pointing, name calling pushing for blame and then legal actions. The report said the fire was an . Fire crews were dispatched to a structure fire around 6:30. The cleaner told officials he found Bates in the room where the fire started and had what appeared to be a warming fire going. By definition, prescribed burning is described as fire applied in a knowledgeable manner to forest and grassland fuels on a specific land area under selected weather conditions to accomplish predetermined, well-defined management objectives, pg 2, http://www.southernfireexchange.org/etc/ITPFISE.pdf. Me, like thousands of Buckeyes make the five-hour trek to Tennessee for family [] While my husband tried to rake the leaves away more than once, they blew right back in. The GSMNP officials were able dodge the negligence and management shortcomings of the 2000 fatal black bear attack in Elkmont as well as discrediting and slandering a former District Law Enforcement Ranger who was involved in the incident. Wednesday, November 23, the day the fire started. I checked historical aerial photos on the USGS website because the die-off of the hemlock has been primarily over the past 10 years in the southeastern Appalachians. This is a text book example of waiting for rain and not planning for WHAT IF! To successfully allow a fire to burn for a long period of time requires VERY skilled personnel and luck. Instead 14 people are dead, many are injured, 2000 structures burned, loss is now a pandemic. Thank you for your kind words and concern about our loss. I wonder when NPS actually put out a request for Incident Management Team support. The 2016 Great Smoky Mountains wildfires, also known as the Gatlinburg wildfires, [1] were a complex of wildfires which began in late November 2016. In late 2016, wildfires . A map posted with the Fire Information sign dated November 27 showed that the park hoped to stopthe fire before it crossed the bottom of drainages on the west, north and east sides, and the Chimney Tops Trail to the south. There are a lot of downed trees and a lot of trails are temporarily closed to deal with them. I appreciate that fine quality of writing that expresses your thoughts in an easy to read yet structured style that makes sense. Bob and Stanton snuck around back roads and made it in a few days earlier than most and found what we were fearing. It is a truism that many people want all the benefits of government, but dont want to pay for them. And each structure became much more of a threat than the spreading ground fire ever was. I could not figure how to put pictures on Wildfire Today, so here are links to let you see whats happened in the Park. Between 2 p.m. and 6 p.m.they increased to 7 to 15 mph with gusts of 22 to 32 mph all generally out of the south, blowing toward Gatlinburg. On Friday, Gatlinburg city officials released a report detailing the downtown fire on Oct. 9. Yet no one made a move. But the last one, issued at 7 a.m. EST on Sunday by Eric Holweg, did predict strong winds. Sunday, four days after the fire started, was the first time that any firefighting aircraft were used on the fire, Ms. Schroer said. They decided instead to monitor and to identifyon a map areas for indirect containment lines which encompassed 410 acres. Two Hawaii police departments are making moves to beef up incentives as recruiting efforts grow more competitive. I have my own opinion on what I would do if I ruled the world but I can guarantee you two people that would be looking for work very soon . Whose else is there? GATLINBURG, Tenn. ( WATE) A building destroyed by fire Sunday in downtown Gatlinburg has been torn down and the investigation into the cause continues. Resources = $$$=taxes. He replied to me on Christmas Eve no less, that they were double checking all the facts to make sure all of their information was as accurate as possible and would keep digging. WBIR is going to interview me as soon as two weeks from now regarding how I was taken for $120,000 by a crooked contractor that I was hooked up with by a log home firm. Gatlinburg fire burns downtown I told him there wasnt when I got there at 5 oclock but I could not even see driveways on the way up. Since November 29 it has rained about every 2 to 3 daysin the Gatlinburg area. Finally a local coalition was formed to put pressure on NPS officials to uphold their mandate on historic structures. It was shaking the car as we drove. For folks afflicted by this tragedy, emotions running high should be expected; and it is understandable for Kelly Morgan to be upset. You do not hang your child or throw them out for, with good intention making the wrong choices, you teach them and help them to understand the consequences. We are still dealing but two of us or degree, the emotional loss of losing our beloved cabin but now we are in the rebuild mode. So because of his and other incompetence property owners are paying the price. Very good pictures! The first thing you think is, Is this real?, said Tyler Neddo, a longtime employee of Caf 420. 119K views 4 months ago GATLINBURG Many people get worried when they hear the words Gatlinburg and Fire in the same sentence. When did Gatlinburg burn . notice should have been at 5-6 given the wind. Property owners still have the rights to protect their property. I hope the governors investigation team finds all of the miscues AND gets proper training for all the different agencies involved. Hindsight is 20/20 and of course much coulda woulda shoulda is understandable. Though it will never be heard in our courts today, dont think the Almighty isnt going to bring it to Light; for human death was involved and the facts were dodged plan and simple. My husband and I were at our house in Gatlinburg, just north of the Park Vista, on the night of the fire. Before the forest fires in the southeast this fall, I didnt know very much about wildfire fighting management (other than a bit from a mountain rescue EMT friend in Colorado and a friend that helps with prescribed burns for Georgia Conservancy). The fire occurred in the Autumn after the deciduous trees had shed their leaves adding more fuel to the forest floor that was already abundant with desiccated leaves, twigs, dead branches, and logs that had been sucked dry of their moisture by the months of drought. I am in my late 60s and have never seen such a drought, or such low stream levels. Our forest service guys have been very busy with hand efforts, running dozers in our hazardous terrain and with aircraft. FF get lulled into thinking they know by instinct but that era ininct will get people killed and thatas what happened. Thought among the locals is that officials didnt want to lose the post-holiday weekend crowd and revenue. According to the great gag order, government officials should not be commenting???? When maintenance employees with GRSM drove past the Chimney Tops 2 Fire early Mondaymorning they saw that the intensity and rate of spread of the fire had increased dramatically. City prosecutors have charged a longtime Mililani High School leader with multiple counts of theft. When enough folks dont take a vulnerable interest in situations and root out the evidence and real root causes to a situation, that is how cover-ups and lies live on, and the wrong people or wrong causes go unrooted. The only way they will learn from the fire is if they have to face a jury of their peers to account for their ineptness even know they were in charge of protecting us and our homes and they did neither. Over 130 sustained injuries, and 1,684 structures have been damaged or destroyed. Anticipating the fire season, firefighting resources (people and equipment) were brought in from around the Southeast and other parts of the country. Oh thats right they did but it was after everything burned! I agree, this has many players to blame and starts with Superintendent Cassius Cash and trickles down to the City and County. National Park Service Supervisory Park Ranger (Protection) in From 7 p.m. until midnight sustained winds were at 13 to 17 mph with gusts from 34 to 49. We spent Thanksgiving there with our family, who left on Sunday. Many are willing to allow the absolute open permission to some to behave as they will without question, but are unwilling to allow others the same room to learn and grow. Thank you for making a point of the fact that we are all human beings with faults by design so that we need each other to succeed and survive. Neitherwas enough rain to halt the drought, of course, nor was it enough to have an extended effect on the the Chimney Tops 2 Fire. Thanks again for your touching reply. The use of smokejumpers could be part of the plan. Dollywood flat out refused to even consider we needed any help and also tried to shame our neighbor to discourage home not to take it. It was considered a total loss after yesterdays fire. So property owners are left to deal with everything and if we had the power we would have done something like worrying the crap out of all of them until action was taken. An in depth investigation should be launched and the (ir)responsible parties identified. The terrain was steep, a vertical distance of 1,300 feet from the bottom of the drainages to the top of the hill. I think anyone that is from this area could see this could be a very dangerous fire from the first day!! This is how the devastating Gatlinburg wildfire erupted overnight By Angela Fritz November 29, 2016 at 1:06 p.m. EST Wildfires raging in the Tennessee resort towns of Gatlinburg and Pigeon. They couldnt get out a cell mssg. Oddly, some folks that posted photos of the fire of the 23rd in its early stages have either pulled the blogs or the material cannot be accessed. Sandra, I agree. My family lives 15 mi. I agree that there needs to to be a change of attitude about climate change, wildfire potential in the east, an adaptation to changing conditions and a throwing out of the holding on to the been there done that, know all there is to know, seen this before thinking and the holding onto a world that used to be. Conspiracy, no. The fire ballooned to more than 17,000 acres when winds stronger than 80 miles per hour carried the fire down the mountain and through Gatlinburg and parts of Pigeon Forge Nov. 28. It is unfortunate that sometimes a few seek to blame someone so quickly that they miss the opportunity to really get to the root of the causes for those issues in the first place. The park needs to share accountability in this situation, and all of us who have formerly worked in fire realize this. By 4:00PM the wind was getting stronger and we were not getting any updated information from local TV news. I have for years pointed out to my students the dead hemlock all over the mountain. That mall is also rigidly enforced. Please keep in mind our commenting ground rules before you post a comment. What Caused the Gatlinburg Fire of 2016? Here's the Real Story Nonetheless, your observations on the 21st indicate that no signs of the 14th fire were present; and if the NPS did fully suppress the first fire, their timeline was undoubtedly non-aggressive to do so. Shelter locations could have been announced, especially encouraging people to take action during the daylight hours that day so that escaping in total darkness during an inferno of fire or not having the means to do so would not be forced on people, and they could make arrangements for their own safety. Just like the mayor of Amity in Jaws, they were not about to evacuate the entire city on Thanksgiving weekend. When you have an active, non controlled fire, an area in exceptional drought, late fall vegetative conditions, and southerly winds of 40 to 60 MPH forecasted, you do not need to be a nuclear physicist to realize the potential (probability) that a catastrophic fire event is right at your doorstep. etc. Would it be wise to implement backfire with such strong winds forecasted on top of exceptional drought and fuels? The Great Smoky Mountains National Park Facebook page reported (on Monday 11/28 at 1046am) that gusting winds have caused the fire to spot across the ridges in the Chimney Tops and Bull head Ridge Area. LeConte. I agree with you Bill that it isnt Most but whether it is a few or many isnt the point for me. Good comments by all. I appreciate how articulately you described your thoughts. With the wildfires scattered across western N.C., we are lucky that, given parallel conditions of the wildfires that swept down the Chimney Tops into Gatlinburg ..i.e. The fire season last year set new records in the state for the expansive area that burned, with more than 4.2m acres (1.7m hectares) scorched by more than 9,900 fires across California. Often times in seeking to take out a person, the real root causes go unaddressed, and sometimes that includes some people taking the fall for decisions of others that were major contributing factors. But the condition of the fuel was also important since it happenedduring what the National Weather Service (NWS) calls exceptional drought conditions. I said a quick prayer for safety and we started up hill to leave our truck. On November 27 the fire was a third of a mileas the crow flies from US Highway 441. It is the duty of the people and Congress to maintain and voice our concerns and opinions to where check and balances work. Fire crews were dispatched to a structure fire around 6:30. Thank you for this excellent synopsis. Bill thank you the excellent i sight and info that is hard to find publicly. Susan, Hasnt anyone noticed that friends groups are paying for major park infrastructure and various other projects that our Congress has failed to provide for? They had no sirens or Claxons blaring, no shouting to evacuate thru their grill mounted speakers. Have a wildland fire news tip? Chief Kurtz was right on target to compare South Canyon, Yarnell, and now Chimney Top 2. Lose their jobs over this? A good example of the kind of human factors that continue to get in the way of better preparedness and change for the good is the backlash in which one reporter from NC received when she asked tough questions of some officials. He asked them how or who we could contact to get emergency information. I felt like people had been robbed of the vital information they needed to make the decisions they needed to be safe. The lawsuits from an event like Gatlinburg could go on for decades. When we reached Turkey Nest Road there was a big white crewcab pickup truck parked in front of Barbaras Real Estate. If it was felt that people on this fire were at risk then dont staff the fire. How many have died in the gatlinburg forest fire? - JacAnswers In turn, the IMT teams greatly appreciated the community support given by the effected areas, such as throwing a free Thanksgiving dinner for the thousands of fire fighters far away from their families. Unusually dry conditions in eastern Tennessee spurred a ban on fires in the national park on Nov. 15. Yes, there had been many fires in the southeast during the 6 to 8 weeks before the fire started in Great Smoky Mountains NP, but it is my understanding that at that time they had diminished and there may have been significant firefighting resources available. One question I have not seen asked is why any adult would have witnessed children playing with matches and lighting fires especially under the obvious conditions in this situation and 1. not taken immediate action 2. They found plenty of resources when they realize they were going to be burning all the money making business is down on Monday. This is as far as this subject needs to go; for the objective of this site is in regard to wildfire. I hope the recordings werent pulled under threat of someones attorney or the DA. In total GFD crews, in addition to, Pigeon Forge Fire Department, Sevierville Fire Department, Sevier County Ambulance Service and Pittman Center Fire Department assisted in extinguishing the blaze. All my constructive criticisms are not targeted to Park personnel in general.
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